i do not understand warding/ambush math

[kenc80]

Sorry for the n00b post here. I've checked the forums and have not seen a good explanation of the warding calculations. I must be missing something or the ambush/warding math is not linear.

Me (attacker): In my stack I have a ranger with with warding up to 85 and a 6HP 70 strength barbie
My stack: barb 70 STR 6HP, Assassin +100 ambush (he had the ambush armor), and ranger 70 ward + titans adamant (+15ward)
Enemy (defending in city): has an assassin with ambush at +44 and an enemy ranger

Then this happens to me, late in the battle:
Ambush roll:
Defender: HeroAssassin rolls 2 (7) Hit!
Ambush on HeroBarbarian, unit dies.

I don't understand how my barbarian died. How could he have died?

GameID 39700

When I mouseover my barbarian he is showing ward 10 but that doesnt make sense, I think that is just the warding the enemy ranger is applying. When I mouseover my Assassin he is showing ward 40 but I dont understand that either. My ranger is showing no ward. Do the rangers wards cancel out? I still dont see how I died.

Thoughts?

Thanks

Ken

[Chazar]

Here is what I have written on our private Team page, maybe this helps:

Ambush & Warding

Each unit receives an Ambush chance once per battle when it reaches the front line, but for most units this chance is 0%. A unit that succeeds its Ambush roll kills the enemy outright, regardless of its strength or hitpoints. So units with Ambush or Group-Ambush capabilities are very useful as suicide shock troops to break powerful stacks. Unlike other bonuses, all Group-Ambush skills stack with each other and the personal Ambush skill of a unit.

It is sometimes claimed that Ambush protects against Ambush, but this is only true for the very first front line pair in a battle. If both units succeed their Ambush roll, the normal battle simply starts without any casualties from Ambush. Since each unit has only one Ambush chance per battle, the Ambush skill of a victorious unit offers no protection against the Ambush skill of the next enemy unit that steps up to the front line.

Warding protects against Ambush. Like anti-air, it depends on the actual pairing of units that meet on the front line. If a unit steps up to the front line, its Ambush chance of x% is reduced if the enemy front line unit has a Warding score of y#, which is the sum of personal Warding and the stacks group Warding score. The effective Ambush chance is x * (1.0 - y) Warbarometer lists all possible Ambush/Warding pairings of a battle for reference. Similarly to Ambush, all Group-Warding stacks with a units personal Warding skill. Note that while the sum of all Group-Ambush is capped at +70%, it can increase the personal Ambush skill beyond 100% (a guaranteed kill), which simply makes Warding more diffcult.

[Chazar]

In addition, I think you are mixing up the ranger's warding (which only protects the ranger herself against ambush if she reaches the frontline), with the Group Warding that the ranger may also provide, but which is usually considerably lower (start at 10, therefore the barbarian has 10 warding).

(I also believe - I dont have time to confirm now - that the mouse-over only shows skills that currently apply (i.e. anti-air only shown against flyers). So the ranger's mouse over only shows warding if the ranger is on the frontline.)

[kenc80]

Thanks for the help Chazar.

On my ranger hero screen I only show an option for

Anti-Air Bonus
Forest Bonus
Swamp Bonus
Group Ward

I dont see anywhere to boost personal warding.

[kenc80]

you know I was just reading KGB's response earlier today in the other forum and maybe the group warding only applies to the first ambush fight. Since My barbarian killed 9 or so guys, everytime after the first he was vulnerable to the ambush??? If thats the case then I guess thats why I died but that doesnt make sense to me logically either and it would seem to really nerf group ward.

[Chazar]

That is correct: the ranger starts with 30 points personal warding and 10 group warding (which add to 40 for the ranger), but as far as I know, the personal warding cannot be increased.

[KGB]

KenC80,

Warding applies against all enemy units. So your Barb had his warding the entire fight. Only Ambush applies to the first unit faced.

The math shown in the battle is in fact correct.

Your Barb had 85 Warding
The enemy Assassin had 44% Ambush.

Warding DOES NOT cancel ambush on a 1-1 basis. The warding number shown is a percentage out of 100 that you cancel. So 85 Warding means you cancel 85% of the enemy Ambush number.

44% * .85 = 37.4% canceled (rounded down to 37)
44-37 = 7.

And indeed you see the enemy unit rolled an ambush roll against (7) and got a 2 and you died.

No love from the dice Gods for you

KGB

P.S. I didn't realize Warding could reach 85%. I thought it was capped around 75 or 80. It's a bit scary to let Barb's get that much Warding from a Ranger making them almost unkillable.