Destroy/Rebuild WatchTowers

[Tim]

Hey Guys,

the Topic of the Game was Lookout Towers. I prefer if they can be razed (without Money) and rebuild (for a Small Amount of Gold, 5 per Range for Example).

I dont like the Idea to raze/rebuilt Temples and Sites and the Things.

And the Discussion about razing with Crows is really useless. Everyone has another Point of View. For Example you can say that the Crow takes the City and then the Inhabitants raze the City...

But i like the Idea that Razing is a Characzeristic of a Unit or Hero .

[Igor]

ha-ha Tim, me and KGB have flooded a lot here
I also don't like now idea of razing temples and ports. Reason is that any unit can raze them but only some units can rebuild them.
But I still offer to raze income buildings as well as looking towers. They both, looking towers and income buildings, have an owner who should think how to defend them or to rebuild.

[KGB]

Lookout towers will need a default defender then even if it's just a scout unit. Otherwise players will run around the map with crows/scouts and raze those towers just to deny them to someone else. That's the kind of cheap tactic the game doesn't need and hence why I said we need units with raze skills.

The same goes for gold sites. Many are way out of the way and hard to defend. It's already easy enough to use your crow/scout to steal the site for a few turns. Will razing them make that much of a difference to the game?

KGB

[Igor]

Agreed that if Lookout towers can be razed they need a defender, may be Light Infantry, to defend them from razing by single Crow or Scout.

[smursh]

Not opposed to a default defender but not sure I agree with your reasoning.

Guard towers have no default defender so no reason you can't run around with crows razing them but nobody seems to be doing that.

[KGB]

I think half the players are scared of guard towers because you are never sure if there are any neutral defenders inside. I *always* have to end up going to the editor to confirm whether I can safely hit it or not.

Also when you conquer a guard tower you are not given a raze option. You have to know to go to the top menu and select raze. That's different than cities where you are given a raze on conquer option. I bet some players may not even know you can raze them if they've never explored the menu system.

KGB

[Igor]

Let me try to write here all possible versions on Look-out towers.

1. Lookouts can't be razed, as this exists now. This lets crows and scouts to run away around all the map and to do scouting that is usual tactic now.

2. Lookouts can be razed and rebuilt, no neutral defenders. This still lets crows and scouts to occupy Lookouts and to raze them after watching. Then for rebuilding a razed Lookout a player need to use only scout, not a crow, because crows can't rebuild. But there are a row of places where can't be reached by a scout, or such reaching is very expensive in time. I saw many Lookouts on little pieces of land which wasn't connected with big land and thus scouts couldn't reach it.
Like this:

1.JPG (22.93 KiB) Viewed 5161 times

Such razing with either impossible or very difficult rebuilding will probably spoil the game.

3. Not all units have ability of razing. This is global question, much more then the current thread and probably shouldn't be solved right here. As for me, I like when all units can raze cities/towers and should be lookouts as well. There could be troubles if a player couldn't raze a city by the last unit in it before leaving it.

4. Lookouts can be razed and rebuilt and they have default defenders. There are three variants of possible defenders.
4.1. Light infantry. Even if this was my own offer I see this defender as too powerfull vs crows and scouts. Only little chance for single crow/scout vs light infantry: 5 vs 10, about 33% or so. This will spoil the using of lookouts by crows/scouts.
4.2. Scout. For crows this situation is the same as with light infantry as scout has additional +5 vs flying crow. And single scout will have only 50% vs scout-defender. Should be this will spoil the using of lookouts as well.
4.3. Crow. This gives for a single scout a good chance to win, 67% or so. And only 50% for single crow. This will give some advantage for scout as a searcher. This should be only variant which could be applied. Or to do nothing with this and to keep lookouts as they are now, like in variant 1.

[KGB]

Igor,

Thanks for taking the time to list the possibilities and post that important screen shot.

For me personally I think the game has to address #3 before it can do anything besides #1 (the current model). That's because the answer to #3 will change how we answer #2 and #4.

KGB