Wish person who set up game had more control over scenarios

[Jeremy]

Scenarios are here, which is awesome.

However, I think we may have taken away too many options from the person who sets up the game (as opposed to the map creator)

If Scenarios are fixed, 4 versus 4 (for example) that is good -- but many fewer people will play it.

I think whoever sets up the game should still have the ability to set:

Size of teams (FFA, 1 v 1, 2 v 2, 3 v 3, 4 v 4, etc.)

How many players are needed to start the game.

Whether there is Fog of War.

Percentage of map needed to win game.

Whether the game is Password Protected (yes, in scenario mode, you currently can't set that either.)


In other words, I love that I can set starting units and home city production (and color!) in scenarios, but everyone wants their game maps played, and game maps get played a lot more when whoever sets up the game has options.

So, my suggestion is remove ALL those restrictions of game setup, and give them back to the whoever sets up the game.

Thanks for considering this!

p.s. England 1066 map is well on it's way!

[SnotlinG]

Hello,

Since this is the first time we release scenarios, I think we will have to learn and adjust after what people want to see Anyway to your questions...

I think whoever sets up the game should still have the ability to set:

Size of teams (FFA, 1 v 1, 2 v 2, 3 v 3, 4 v 4, etc.)

The problem here is for the system to know which sides on the scenario should be on what team. If you for example create a scenario which is 4v4 and specify the 4 teams per side in the mapeditor. If the host then decides to run it as 2v2v2v2, its hard for the system to know which side goes into which team. Which is the reason why a scenario has pre-defined sides/teams

How many players are needed to start the game.

Whether there is Fog of War.

Percentage of map needed to win game.

Whether the game is Password Protected (yes, in scenario mode, you currently can't set that either.)

I think all these should be possible to set. I´ll check with piranha.

[Jeremy]

I understand -- and appreciate -- the concern. But ultimately, we want people to play, and they are going to want to play in all kinds of configurations.

Several ways this could be made so that the person who sets up the game has the power.

We could submit scenarios in lots of forms. There could be Middle Earth FFA, Middle Earth 4 v 4, Middle Earth 2v2v2v2, etc. Then, the set up person could choose the Scenario they wanted.

Or, it could be an option at game set-up to choose sides -- We can even have people choose particular nations. Then it could be agreed upon in advance by the players -- want to play Fellowship, Rohan, and Gondor versus Orcs, Sauruman and Mordor (for example)

Dunno -- like I said, lots of possible ways to implement it. But having maps that can ONLY be played 4 versus 4 probably isn't the answer.

[piranha]

I agree with you Jeremy, we need to come up with a solution for saving maps in different versions or somehow make the same map work in different setups. Its quite difficult to come up with a system that works in all situations and not making it very complicated. To not talk about the amount of time that needs to be spent making it. But that is also why we take it step by step because its hard to know how things should work. We want to avoid making a bad system and then having to scrap it like we did with a lot of stuff in B4.

For example your map is 4v4 so making it 1v1, 2v2, 3v3 should be easy. But lets say there is a map with 1 side 2 humans, another side with 3 human and one side with 1 computer. How should you change that map and not break it?
I guess the only solutions is save the map in several versions and perhaps they could be linked somehow so the maplist don't have to be crowded with 6 versions of each map.


I've opened the other hosting options.

[Jeremy]

Consider simple: Just give all the control back to the person setting up the game.

Then people can set up what they want -- yes, they'll be explicitly choosing starting locations, but that's not the end of the world. No one has to join a game if they don't want to.

We'll still get the scenario advantages of defined starting units, defined production and gold in starting cities, and defined colors.

[piranha]

You can now edit advanced settings, close spots in case you want to play fewer than 4v4 and you can add AIs in scenario games.

[LichKing]

The problem here is for the system to know which sides on the scenario should be on what team. If you for example create a scenario which is 4v4 and specify the 4 teams per side in the mapeditor. If the host then decides to run it as 2v2v2v2, its hard for the system to know which side goes into which team. Which is the reason why a scenario has pre-defined sides/teams

Maybe you could do something like this in the scenario settings:



Each setting would be valid only for the selected kind of game, and the program should remember the settings you chose for each one (4v4, FFA, 2v2...). So the mapmaker could choose different settings (starting positions mostly) depending on the type of game.

[Jeremy]

That looks like a good option, LichKing.

Still couldn't start a 3 player FFA (maybe I need to set my map back to Standard)

Also, still couldn't get a Scenario game going at all -- as they're not showing up in My Games, or in the list of game my opponents would like to join.

Thanks for the very quick response time in the past -- it's impressive!

Jeremy

[SnotlinG]

LichKing, good feedback. Its a bit though to figure out how to get everything in, and also to make it easy to understand Will definitely consider this suggestion. But its a bit of work, so wont happen until earliest beta6.

Jeremy, I see there is a problem in the open games list. Ill check tomorrow and see why your scenariogames are not shown.

[SnotlinG]

Scenariogames should now be listed in the gamelist for everyone!