The Catapult, the Elemental, and the Worm

[magian]

So, all the titular characters are 3 turn units, with 3 wounds, that excel at attacking cities. They all have average movement. Also 2 of the 3 like desert terrain (especially wormy).

There are some differences. The catapult is significantly cheaper (not sure why) and shares its siege with friends. Wormy prefers to share its amazing mobility in desert. And the elemental makes up for its lack of siege with a fat +15 attack, so it's handy in any attack situation.

Of the three, I'm least impressed with the elemental. The other two seem to have a bit more going on. I'm curious to know how others rate these three units.

[strach]

I had some great results when I combined a sandworm with a high-level DK and a dragon. Worm was on the front line with S47, DK cut down the strength of defending units to 5 (it was possible since the worm ignored the +15 walls), so the worm "singlehanded" killed the whole city crew (there were around 12 units). so the worms are a good pick if you dont have a siege.

if I know I have a lot of castles to conquer in future I always buy a catapult. when you have a good DK and a catapult you can really limit your damages to minimum (in fact almost all "invincible" stacks must have some negating qualities). the other thing is you want to have your armies as diverisified as possible - if an archon gets in your way, you should be able to fight him. so you cant lay all your hopes for exemple on a hero or a dragon and here comes the siege - it is very often a "tiebreaker" or an X-factor. and since there is a possibility of vectoring when you play on a big map it is always a good investment.

[magian]

Stratch, you mentioned the worm and the catapult, but not the elemental. Do you also find the elemental to be the least useful of the three?

[Draxus]

Elementals can also walk on volcanic tiles. On certain maps it can be a mean surprise early in the game.

[strach]

magian
I guess so, but as they are cheap allies you can often get 3 or 4 of them, and when they come in a right time and right place you can join them with a dragon and make some serious damages to your opponent

[LPhillips]

Elementals are definitely situational units. Compare the Demon, which flies and is just as strong on defense as it is on attack. It's also only a 3-turner. Sure, it has 2 wounds, but when you get a pile of them you also get a swarm bonus -and that's huge when the cap is 65 strength and it's so easy to get them together (again, they're fliers).

Elemental
The biggest detriments to Elemental are its base strength and its slow movement. If it had 20 base strength or even 25, it would be a hell of a unit. Its slow movement really balances even that much strength. The +attack is factored into the max of +30, so it would still be capped at 55 strength. The two possible abuses are vs. players or vs. neutrals. So, to address these two issues: It's already strong enough to kill most neutrals, so the thing stopping it from being overabused for expansion is its movement. More strength won't change this. Against players, its weakness is on defense and at 20 or 25 it would still be relatively weak on defense for a 3-turn combat unit. 20 with +20 would be OK, but caps it at 50 strength. Not bad for a 3-wound unit.
Of course an increase in strength would have to come with an increase in price (1200-1400?), but I think it would really validate this unit and even bring it into the forefront of strategies. No longer would Demon hordes be the uncontested pinnacle of all good stacks.

Catapult
Catapults are cheap because people don't use them. I find them to be essential against decent players, especially on newer maps where mapmakers are using all of the wonderful tools available now like towers and extra defenders. Like anything, the situation has to be right: A map with difficult terrain and low income/production doesn't warrant catapults.

Sandworm
These units are indispensable in their native terrain. Beyond that, I don't know what to use them for. Strach's suggestion is brilliant, and seems like it would be very effective on maps with low-medium income where worm production is provided to the player. A tank unit that eliminates lowlevel defenders without the need for siege is really a good tactical option.

[magian]

Lphillips, the elemental is str 25 with a +15 bonus. Are you saying it should get an attack bonus of 20-25? I'm a little confused.

When using worms, I generally keep them in the back row while moving, then switch them to the front just before an attack on an enemy city. With a hero (or two) and some morale/fear, the worm can survive an attack on quite well defended cities (meaning you take no losses). I find this tactic works best with a mid-high level valkyrie.

I use, love and buy catapults. I have yet to pillage catapult production (unless I can't hold the city), they are just too useful.

[LPhillips]

Oh, I thought it was 15+15. Where did I get that?

Catapults are awesome. Thus my thread pointing out how good they are, and how underutilized.
That point of view was lambasted pretty heavily by KGB and others, heh.

[magian]

Yeah 15+15 would be way too weak. Right now, it is a strong unit, but the worm is 30 strength base, and is just that little bit quicker. Gives the worm the edge IMO. Plus, if there is any sand nearby, wormy is the obvious choice.

I didn't know the elemental could walk on lava, does make sense though.

For the record, I like getting elementals as allies (if they show up near the front lines).

[magian]

Yeah, the catapult can be used much like a worm. Put it in the front row during an attack on a heavily defended city. With its 3 wounds and +10 attack strength, it can really dish out some hurt on the enemy.