Besides Demons, other character changes I might like

[YoureMrLebowski]

Demons need to be reduced in power. Also, I would like to see...

Devils - I would like this to be the equal opposite of Red Dragons, so instead of having 8 negate aura and 2 fear, it should have 10 fear, and no negate aura. I think the Great Archon has the negate aura covered, so what is the point. Further, the attack points should be moved up to 40. Make the cost the same as well. That would make this the equivalent of a red dragon, but the dark side.

Green Dragon - This is a tough unit to want right now. Why take a green dragon when a worm or elemental has the same heart bonus with less production time, great flying? Also, worms, elementals, and gryphons have attack bonus in a city which places their attack points above a green dragon, so why not take those cheaper units. Either, the time needs to be three turns with the attack value lowered to 30, with a lowered cost for production; or an extra attack value needs to be added. It could have attack value in a city, ability to negate walls, be a stronger elepphant, it could have +5 leadership, +10 when attacking... something.

Gryphons - This is kind of an overpowered unit. They are basically flying spiders with better movement. I think they are too strong though. The attack bonus on a city should total no more than 40, so they are not stronger than a spider. The spider is limited because it moves so slow, and can easily be caught in a field or in the mountains. The gryphon isn't fast, but it can get to a city before it is seen more often. I think this is too much of an advantage, so 40. Fire Elementals could probably be reduced as well.

[Moonknight]

Devils negate differs from Archons...it negates Fear and Morale, where Archons negate Chaos and Leadership. I do feal that the -2 Fear is an odd factor for the Devil, I think it should be raised to -4.

I feel the Gryphons are perfect the way they are, elves/wizards/unicorns are available to counteract. It is a 3 turn unit and costs more than Spiders and Minotaurs, which is why it should be better than those units.

As far as the Green Dragon, it might depend on what happens to the Demon...right now, I'd produce Demons over GDs all the time b/c 4 Demons vs. 3 GD is like an 80% victory. Don't underestimate the goup move bonus either, on large maps it comes in handy. Elementals are slow and vulnerable on defense, while Sandworms don't get the benefit of city walls on defense. Being able to fly, and fly fast with 3 hits makes the GD much better.

[YoureMrLebowski]

I like your input, I would still love to see the changes listed, but you do make good points.

That is a great point with the archons/devils, I did not really understand the difference in their negative aura. I still like the idea of separating devils and archons along the lines of fear vs negative aura. I would change devils as I originally suggested and I guess I would make great archons negate 8 of leadership/fear and then 16 for moral/chaos.

[Yahtzee]

Given Moonknight's clarification for you, I'm not clear on why you want to take away the devil's negate power.

[YoureMrLebowski]

Given Moonknight's clarification for you, I'm not clear on why you want to take away the devil's negate power.

Because I would like a character that has a high strength against anyone, and not just the ability to negate certain characters leadership/moral/chaos/fear. This is because I would like more characters I would be willing to produce. Right now, I do not see why anyone would produce Devils. I can see where you would keep it if you came across a castle producing them, but not buy production of them. It would also make it fun to produce red dragons and devils together, because combined they would create a 60 strength if the changes were made.

[LPhillips]

Mr. Lebowski,
You should make a point of getting some more experience in big games on wealthy maps with good players. You'll find that if you are unwilling to purchase Devils, you will lose.

You will also find that some of your opinions about what you have suggested here will change radically. Warbarons is similar to Physics: The same principles are at work on a large scale as opposed to a small scale, but things do change drastically. It's always good to thoroughly explore the game and its strategy before suggesting sweeping changes, and then the best way of all to know if your opinion about the effectiveness of units is well developed is to compare your playing ability to long-time veterans. If you can, say, hold your own with KGB, Moonknight, Star, Ken, or any of the many good active players, then you know you've got a pretty good grasp of the game.

Luke